AI Backlash Kickoff
Hey, what’s going on? Welcome to “The Doug Show.” I’m Doug Cunnington, and today I’m gonna talk about AI, roughly negative ideas about AI. And the reason this was, like, triggered, uh, as an idea for me is, uh, the stupid YouTube algorithm. And th- there’s a couple pieces that all kinda came together, but basically I’ve been seeing a handful of videos in the last, I would say, 24 hours that were talking about kinda like, uh, the AI bubble, and I’ll briefly talk about some of that stuff.
So AI bubble, uh, people being like kind of discontent with AI and generally, like, not liking it. And it kinda came together with another thing that happened in my YouTube, uh, algorithm and viewing habits.
Spotting AI Guitar Channels
And I watch a lot of guitar stuff, and there were a few, uh, YouTubers that were covering this, covering this story.
One of them broke. Basically, there was a, a newer guitar YouTube channel that I, you know, I think maybe it’s just been around for a few months, but it was, it was AI, so the person was AI, the background was fake, and the, the script was written by AI, which y- you could tell that it was written by AI. And it sort of made, like, some outrageous claims, and it, it flowed exactly how you would expect an AI script to flow.
One of the things that you could tell right away is words were mispronounced and the cadence was a little bit off. So even if you didn’t know that it was an AI channel, you would think that something funny is going on, and probably if you’re listening to this, if you’re watching this, you already can identify, like, mispronounced words in your, uh, you know, content that you’re viewing or listening to, and you’re like, “Oh, this is clearly AI.”
So we’re kind of– We’re, uh, we’re able to identify it even if we’re not experts in AI content and we haven’t seen it before, but not everyone knows that.
Dad Fooled by AI Video
And I remember a few months back, my dad sent me, um, a video because I asked him to. He was like, “Hey, I’m not drinking this, these two different beers anymore.”
And I was like, “Oh, that’s funny. Why is that?” He said, “Well, I watched a video and they said…” I think it was, like, Coors and s- some other. He was like, “Yeah, they, they did some tests, and there’s actually, um, a lot of, like, there’s some harmful compounds in there, and it’s not, it’s not a good beer.” And I was like, “Hey, send me that video, ’cause that, that actually does not sound right.”
So he sent me the video. Within the first 10 seconds, they mispronounced a word. Um, it was Michelob, and they– I don’t remember how they said it. They, it was like Malcobe or something like that, and I was like, “What the fuck did they just say? Did they try to say Michelob, but they mispronounced it?” And, uh, sure enough, later on, like, they pronounce it correctly and then mispronounce it again.
So it’s just kind of a weird thing, and I was like, “Hey, Dad, actually, this This video is like complete garbage. There are inconsistencies, um, and it doesn’t make sense, and I think it was written by AI and it’s just a like sort of video essay so there’s no person on there at all. They’re just showing B-roll and other, um, probably AI-generated video in the background.
So I was like, “I wouldn’t worry about it.” I mean, I think whatever test they’re referencing, it could be true, but you’re talking about like whatever the acceptable micron range of having, I’m just making it up, but having some chemical, I w- I won’t even make one up to not start rumors, but we’ll say uranium ’cause I think, uh, AI is trained on these videos, so who gives a shit?
So, so anyway, I’m just making that up, but at the same time I was like: Hey, Dad, don’t worry about it. Everything in the video, uh, I would say is like untrustworthy and they’re just trying to get the video shared and have like shock value, and people are super active in the comments as they are correcting the information or saying, “Oh yeah, I don’t like this,” or, “I do like that.”
So That said, a lot of the chatter in the comments could literally just be more AI garbage, or they could be comments that someone’s paying to, like, have added on there.
Rhett Shull Copycat Drama
So anyway, I’m, I’m watching, you know, some of these guitar YouTubers, and they’re talking about, um, this other channel that is mimicking very closely Rhett Shull, who’s, uh, very big in the gear and guitar, um, YouTube space.
I– He m- he’s between, like, 500,000 and a million, um, subs, so it’s a very big channel, and he has a couple videos where he’s, like, frustrated. He’s like, “Oh yeah, they’re definitely copying me.” Like, it has, um, the same, like, denim jacket. The background looks super similar, and it was clear that they were trying to mimic it.
Rhett was very upset. I think he tried to file, um, some copyright, uh, you know, infringement type stuff within YouTube, which they were like, “Yeah, we’re not gonna do anything,” as far as I could tell. And, um, it… I, I commented on there. I mean, hun- hundreds, thousands of people commented on a couple of his videos, but basically it wasn’t copying him exactly.
It was just a very, uh, similar facsimile, which is completely redundant, and it looked similar, but they weren’t copying anything specific. The thing is, the information in the videos was, like, kind of shitty, and unfortunately, I don’t think Rhett can do anything about someone ch- like, if someone just, like, dressed like him and kind of acted like him, there’s nothing you could do about that.
I mean, if someone’s copying something exactly, that’s a little bit different. Maybe if they copied the script exactly. But if it’s just a close resemblance and they’re just trying to copy you, can’t do anything about that. And one of the comments that I put on there, I was like, “Well, they’re not copying you exactly, so I mean, I don’t think you can actually do anything.”
Copyright Limits and DMCA
Secondary, I was like, you know, we had this in, like, the blogging world. I mentioned, you know, a decade ago, but it probably goes back a little earlier. Um, but at some point there were a little bit, there were more tighter, um, or sorry, there were tighter, uh, I guess, rules around it. So if someone actually did exactly copy your web, uh, page and the content, then there was a mechanism for you to request, um, based on the I, I g- I think it was the hosting company, so you could file a, uh, DMCA request and say, “Hey, you need to do something about it.”
And then if they, if they didn’t, if the webmaster didn’t, then the, uh, hosting company would do something about it. So, so anyway, there was some mechanism and I was like, oh yeah, this is similar but different. And if they are just maybe copying the title, they could even copy the sections as long as they’re writing it uniquely.
Back in those days it’s like, eh, it’s pretty close, but you know what? You can’t do anything about it because they’re not copying you exactly. It’s just a very close, similar thing. And I mean, you could extend this out to other places where it’s like a book, you know, especially a nonfiction book. You could, I mean, get really close.
You could go to someone’s table of contents and, and then essentially copy that, maybe make some of your own changes. You could probably have the same kind of sections and beats. Consult your own, you know, IP lawyer. This is all just entertainment. But I mean, if you write a book and just base it very closely on another book, again, especially nonfiction, I mean, it’s your own take on it, so there’s no major issue.
So anyway, a lot of people were upset about this and I was like, “Ah, it kind of sucks.” No one wants to see this kind of AI slop. It’s generally, like, poor information and not, uh, it’s not real. It’s not real information. Now, one thing, uh, on this copy of Rhett Scholl’s channel They, they seem to mention– The guitar YouTubers that talked about it seemed to mention comments, and they, they were like, “Oh, these are real comments out there.
It looks like these are real.” And I’m not so sure, ’cause some of them just seemed like too, too spot on, like, “Oh, thanks for the information,” and people going back and forth. Seems like bullshit to me, so I’m not sure if they’re real comments. They look like they’re real comments, and boy, having real comments or things that look like real comments in there sure is helpful for the channel overall, but probably not real.
Paul Lipsky AI Pivot
So I’m gonna go over a couple, uh, things that I observed on, uh… ‘Cause I watched a few of the anti-AI videos. And, and then I’m gonna counter, because I was doing some light research preparing for this episode, and I saw that one of my friends, Paul Lipsky, who was on the channel, um, some time ago, a year, two years ago, I don’t remember.
Um, he’s local here, so he actually came to the studio. Um, I’ve seen him since. Like, we hike together occasionally, although I haven’t seen him in a while. But anyway, he did, um, content on, like, drop shipping and stuff like that. That’s what we talked about here. We talked about TikTok, and I went on my YouTube feed, and I was like, “Let’s filter down on AI,” and one of his recent videos popped up.
So I was like, “Oh, Paul’s talking about AI here.” So I clicked over to his channel, and he pivoted to AI. And I remember chatting with him a few– Ah, fuck, I don’t remember. A few months ago, and he was like, “Yeah, I’ve kinda shifted to some other area.” It was not yet AI. But I looked through his feed, and he’s publishing a lot, and it’s all AI related.
So I need to text him today, see if I can schedule an interview in the next couple weeks here, um, see if I could talk to him about, like, what’s going on and, like, how he shifted. And the other thing is I’m pretty sure his channel had I don’t know, say 100 to 150,000 subs when I chatted with him. And when I looked today, it was like four– it was over 400,000.
So his channel’s growing a lot, and I was looking at the views and I was like, “Holy shit, he’s getting a lot of views.” So kudos to Paul. I will link up to his channel, but it’s kind of the antithesis of what I’m talking about today, where it’s like, uh, AI backlash and then, uh, what Paul is covering is like, um, new releases, like all the news around AI, plus AI tutorials, so, uh, helpful stuff.
And Paul’s a friend of mine. He’s a good guy, so I, I have no issue with it. It’s just interesting depending on what you are watching, like YouTube will feed you maybe a little bit more of that stuff, and I think it showed up, Paul’s video showed up on my feed because I am subscribed to him, and it was in the AI content area.
So it just popped up, and I was like, “Oh, cool.” And there was a bunch of other stuff, too. So very interesting.
Is There an AI Bubble
Number one, one of the YouTube videos is, uh, and one of the topics in the anti-AI section is essentially talking about the AI bubble. So this one is, uh, certainly debatable. People will talk about a bubble, and it’s kind of the eye of the beholder in, in most cases, ’cause you’ll hear arguments on both sides.
Extremely convincing If I had to, if I had to put money on it myself, I would say, yeah, there’s probably some bubble. I, I think some things are overvalued. One of the cited things is the sort of circular, circular investment that is happening where maybe NVIDIA is like, “Yeah, we’re going to invest a bunch into, um, OpenAI.”
And then OpenAI is like, “Great, um, we have this influx of money, and with this money from NVIDIA, we’re gonna buy chips from NVIDIA.” So you end up with like, you know, “Hey, take this money so that you can buy stuff from me,” and then that works out. The other one that I heard was, um, like Oracle was gonna make a huge investment in, um, or maybe Microsoft.
Microsoft, a huge investment in Claude. I’m just making stuff up. In, uh, Anthropic. Um, ’cause I’m getting some of the details wrong. But instead of like actual investment, it’s just, uh, compute time. So it’s like getting a bunch of, um, gift cards for, uh, compute time with Oracle or Microsoft or whomever it was in that case.
So some circular investment, um, where from an accounting perspective, it’s like, “Oh, we’re making this big investment over here.” That company is making another big investment, uh, giving the money back to the, the company that sent it to them. So anyway, you get the idea of the circular investment here.
Subsidized Pricing Trap
The other one, uh, so number two is the subsidized cost that we’re seeing.
So, you know, we’re paying 20 bucks a month or Uh, whatever f- even $50 a month. I, I don’t– I’m not subscribed to a ton of these, uh, AI services, but it’s, uh, you know, much cheaper than it should be. You know, even if you’re like sort of a power user, you’re paying like 100 bucks a month. I mean, if you’re using it a bunch, then it’s gonna be, uh, somewhat of a problem.
So you end up in a situation where we’re using these tools, especially, you know, if you’re, if you’re told at your company, “Hey, you gotta use these AI tools. Use them as much as possible,” and then they jack up the prices, then there’s gonna be an issue there. So th-this is, uh, something that we’re probably gonna see before too long.
And again, many of these videos cited that. And we could look back to a, a lot of the, you know, big tech companies did something like this. So great example is Uber, where in the early days, they made Uber super cheap, so people get used to it, and then they slowly raised the prices. Um, in a lot of ways, Uber is still super convenient, but they definitely, you know, met the, uh, the proper market rate or at least close to it at this point.
I still like using Uber or Lyft, um, especially like in traveling to certain places. A few years ago, we went to San Diego, and I was like, “Should we rent a car? Like, we’re gonna be there for a week, and, you know, we wanna be able to move around and all that stuff.” And I was like, “You know what? Let’s just try to get, like, a walkable place, and then we’ll Uber everywhere that we need to go.”
And it ended up being, like, a much easier, like, less stress. We tended to stay in the neighborhood, which was, uh, Mission Beach. Great place to go. I mean, that’s where I would want to be anyway. We ended up Ubering here and there, but it was not a huge deal, and it was way less stress. Uh, didn’t have to buy gas, um, didn’t have to pay for parking, didn’t have to figure out where to park.
Usually, but not always, usually you can, you know, land at the airport, get your rental car, and get out of there. Occasionally, you have to wait in line, and there’s some mix-up, and you have to do some other stuff. And, um, my, my, uh, sister and brother-in-law, we’ve traveled with them a couple times, and I know, um, they tend to have worse luck, where they’re like, “Oh yeah, we were stuck at the rental car place for, like, um, an hour.”
So that sort of… It doesn’t always happen, but, like, um, the minor headache. Anyway, just outsourcing that piece when I know I’m not gonna be driving everywhere is a great way to do it. So anyway, Uber.
Google AI Overviews Problem
Good example of subsidizing cost early on to get users used to that service The next one is Google Search.
So this is one that I wasn’t really thinking about. Um, I, I think I heard about it, but basically, you know, you go to Google Search and now we have the AI overviews, which honestly, as much as I don’t want to admit it, a lot of times it is a pretty good summary The thing is, it, it is wrong though. It is wrong often, and I actually, I observed one of those, and it only, uh, stood out to me because I’m an expert in the area or, or lightly an expert.
I’ll, I’ll tell you what it is in a second, but basically I was like, “That doesn’t sound right.” And then, you know, of course the source was a forum or Reddit, I can’t remember which one. And I was like, “You know what? What, what does this say?” So I actually went to the source and I was like, “Oh, this person didn’t know what the fuck they were talking about.”
So, like the information in the AI overview was not accurate. That said, a lot of times if it is accurate, it is a good summary and you can go look at the sources. Um, but the issue here is Google search was a awesome way for Google to make money, right? So it was pretty cheap to run a query, and then there were ads there.
So yeah, Google’s able to print money for 20 plus years, right? So now they have the AI overview, which costs a lot of money. So instead of… I don’t know how much it costs, but instead of being like one penny per search, just making that up, it’s, uh, whatever, it’s 18 cents. So the, the math, the margins are completely wrecked, and now, um, I’m finding myself, I see the AI overview, and then I go into the AI mode, and then I start asking more detailed questions ’cause I, you know, I’m testing it out, seeing how it works.
So the example that I gave, um, that I could tell you now is around like vacuum tubes and a tube amp, and I, I’m like, “Hey, I have this amp and I’m thinking about changing the, uh, the preamp tube. What options do I have?” And it basically, it, it said, “Oh, here are the options. You could put a 12AX7, you could put an AY7, AU7,” whatever.
So there are definitely some options there. But, uh, it said there could be a major issue if you put a- an AX7 into an AY7 because of the voltage differences, and you could, you know, damage it. And I was like, well, again, I know a couple things because of my electrical engineering days, ’cause I was like, “Am I really an expert?”
But I have taken, um, some classes and I was like, I think, you know, there’s a, you know, different amplification level for each of the tubes. But I was like, going from a lower tube to a higher tube, I was like, there could be some different, uh, impedances or whatever, like some different things to consider.
But I’m like, it shouldn’t u- like it should use less voltage because I’m going up. And a- anyway, so when I went and I researched Whatever the AI overview was citing, I saw that it was someone in a forum who was literally like, “I think maybe there might be an issue with the voltages, so be careful maybe.”
And they’re, they’re like, “I don’t know what I’m talking about. I’m just some dude talking about amplifiers. I’m not an electrical engineer.” They just said, “I think you may have an issue.” So when I, I said, “Hey, what is the voltage difference between these two tubes?” And then AI was like, “Oh, you’re right. A- actually, there’s no issue with that.
Um, actually, you would see the opposite effect.” So that is an issue. So the overall idea here with this Google search, um, is when they’re putting the AI overviews, it’s actually costing them a lot more money than the old style of just search results. And I mean, I don’t know what’s, I don’t know what’s better or worse.
I, I think anything that I actually care about the, the, the information in there, where I’m gonna put a new tube into my amp, or I’m gonna put a different rating into my new, um… I have a new condenser mic that has, um, a vacuum tube in there as well. So I’m like, “Oh, these are pretty much interchangeable.” And I’m like, “Oh, what if I put in a, a different tube?
Am I gonna run into issues?” ‘Cause I, I was like, “I’m gonna buy a few, like, vintage tubes and have some fun with it,” which is a whole other story. But, um, when you– when I’m actually y- you know, plugging things in where there’s high voltages passing through, or it’s an expensive microphone and I don’t wanna mess it up, then it matters a little bit more, and I’m not gonna trust the information in there because the AI overviews are just made up of, you know, fucking assholes in the forums that maybe know what they’re talking about, maybe they don’t, but I have no way to verify it, so I wouldn’t necessarily believe just, uh, some random person.
I mean, that’s how they are. I mean, that’s how it is in, like, um, I guess Facebook groups or forums in general, where it’s just like, yeah, pe- people are talking about something that they heard someone else talk about, but they don’t actually have any first-hand knowledge with it. So it’ll be very interesting to see how Google search shifts and are, you know, ads gonna cost a lot more for the advertisers to pay for because they, they now have to support the, the greater cost of the AI search?
I’m not sure. Uh, it’ll be interesting to see how this plays out All right. We’re coming up on the, the last few here. Um, I will take a quick pause and mention another thing that I, I ended up watching was, it’s, um, this creator named Husk IRL, and I think I- he started popping up on my Instagram feed, but then he started popping up on my YouTube feed as well.
And I believe he is a gamer of some kind, but he seems kind of awkward, and he’s one of the folks that you may have seen his, his, um, shorts or his YouTube videos. And he’s one of the folks who is, uh, recording a video, and he’s, like, asking AI, I think ChatGPT, he’s like, “How many E’s are in the word seventeen?”
And then AI replies back, “Oh, there are two E’s in the word seventeen.” And then he asks AI to spell it, and then it spells it, and he’s like, “Hey, wait a second. There’s actually five,” or, “Hey, there’s actually one,” and AI just agrees with him each time. So there’s a series of videos like that, but he’s also done, um, some other, like, long form.
So I started seeing these over on the YouTube side where he goes on, like, dates with AI, and I’m not sure if it’s actually, like, an AI, um, like, dating service website or if it’s, um, just some AI, like, avatar. ‘Cause there’s a person over there, like, talking back and forth, and then I don’t know if he prompts it and says, “Hey, we’re going on a date.”
And then he’s very awkward. It’s pretty f- funny. I think it’s– he’s intentionally awkward, and it, it was– seemed really weird at first, but, like, once you get his vibe, I’m like, “Oh, this is actually very funny the way he, he does this and the way he interacts with the, uh, the voice chat AI.” So I’ve been watching his videos and, um, generally at the end of the day, he makes AI look kind of dumb.
I’ll mention one other. He was trying to get AI to count to 100, and I think he had, like, three phones. He was like, “Hey, I have three of you here. Count to 100.” And I think it took him, like, 45 minutes. They spent most of the time talking about what they were going to do, and it ends up being just a, you know, like a “Who’s on First?”
comedy situation with AI talking to each other. So it’s completely ridiculous, and at the end of the day, it ends up being a huge waste of my time. But amusing, and I guess it was research for th- for this episode. All right. One other thing that came up is, um, this is number four. So Meta is selling their capacity for their AI infrastructure, so their compute power, they’re selling that instead of, like, using it for their own AI tools, which is super interesting.
I mean, I think a lot of the, the AI companies, they were spending on building out the infrastructure. I was looking at hard drives the other day. Hard drives and memory are, like, all super expensive, which that kinda… F- for me, I wasn’t paying attention, so it kinda came out of nowhere. I was like, “Oh, yeah, hard drive space is cheap,” whatever.
And then I was like, “Oh, shoot. Now computers cost more.” And I was talking to a friend, like, “I need to upgrade my computer.” I was kind of looking around, poking around Looking at prices, and now I see prices are up, and I– you know, it was one of those deals I’m like, “Ah, shoot, I, I should’ve bought whatever I was thinking about buying,” and it was like, you know, 200, $300 cheaper, um, a few weeks ago.
So oops. It’s not, not the worst thing, but it represented a pretty large, uh, percentage increase. So anyway, Meta is selling their capacity instead of using it, which kind of tells you that they’ve, they’ve looked at it and they’re like, “You know what? We’re gonna let other folks work on this. We have capacity, so we’re gonna sell it.”
And I– You know, that’s probably subject to change. Um, I heard this in the last couple days. By the way, many of the videos that I saw, um, they seem to have been out in the last two weeks, so say the end of June forward. So kind of recent, where there was, you know, a l- a lot of, uh, you know, smaller creators talking about it, and then there were bigger, like, news, news sources out there that were covering it on a, on a bigger scale.
All right.
AI Slop and Job Fears Wrap
The last two, they kind of go hand in hand, and this is something that I have been kind of struggling with, but just the AI slop. So I mentioned it in the opening, where there’s YouTube videos that are essentially scripted by AI. The whole video is AI, and it’s obviously bad content. I think if you were, like, a casual observer and you were like, “I don’t know anything about the beer industry,” and you watch this video, and then you re- you’re like, “Oh, wow, the, this is really bad.
Here are the five, um, the five beers that I should be drinking out there that are safe.” And, um, I was like, “Man, this is, uh, just all nonsense.” Like, if there was poison in the beers, then it, it would be banned. Like, this, there’s no, there’s no question. So this extended again to the guitar industry. So people do not like AI slop, and I run into it on, you know, a- any of the social platforms or anything where there’s, uh, user-generated content.
It’s like people are trying to exploit it and, you know, make it worse. Or they’re just trying to earn money. I, I mean, they’re not intentionally making it worse. They’re just, they don’t care about the consequence of having worse content out there. And then the last one here, which was covered in many of the stories, is people, essentially workers, do feel threatened with AI because, I mean, the CEOs and folks are like, “Yeah, AI is gonna take all the jobs, and it’s gonna be able to automate all this stuff.”
And at this point, you know, there, there’s a lot of more backlash, which I guess is the main theme of this whole episode. So workers feel a threat to their jobs because we’re being told that AI is a threat to, you know, white-collar work and just a lot of different work out there. And I mean, in our, you know, industry from the, you know, digital marketing online world, huge disruption already, right?
I mean, we used to talk about content websites and niche websites, and that shifted dramatically when there were AI tools that could write content better. So the, you know, everything got flooded. Now it’s moved a level up, and it’s doing, uh, AI’s doing video, right? So now there’s videos out there. So we’re seeing that as well.
But this was happening as soon as people were able to use AI writing tools that weren’t complete garbage. I mean, they used them when it was complete garbage, but it got a little bit better and a little better, to the point where people were, you know, developing tools. Like, people in this audience were developing tools to be able to publish, you know, huge amounts of content, where you could publish whatever, a dozen articles a day and just, like, fill websites with volumes and volumes of content.
And It took jobs from, you know, writers f- at that point, ’cause many of us were hiring writers, um, and actual people writing the content. So people were, were writing it, and I believe, um, most of those sort of roles went away. We see it with, like, uh, graphic design as well. That’s changed a huge amount, and I have heard– I mean, if you just, like, browse YouTube, you will see tons of thumbnails that are just AI-generated.
So there’s definitely a backlash, and I mean, I, I definitely am turned off a little bit, and I remember, uh, it was probably a year or two ago. I remember a friend, he was like, “Yeah, I uploaded whatever, 20, 20 images of myself, and then now I can just ask this tool to create a thumbnail or whatever in any situation,” which I think we could probably do a lot of that just, uh, with almost any of the AI tools these days.
So it’s interesting, it’s interesting to see it going on, and the point is, like, the, the jobs that did go away, like the graphic designers, the writers, um, there’s other, there’s other things probably on the chopping block. It hasn’t come through for things, um… Maybe I’m, I’m taking it a little too far, but, like, when there has to be some decisions made.
I– Maybe I don’t have enough experience, but I have heard people say, “Oh yeah, I have, I’ve built, um, this agent and then another agent, and then this agent is the manager of those,” so they go out and do things, and I’m curious to see how it plays out. I mean, if it’s a good tool, a lot of times one of the AI companies will, like, bring that in-house, and they’re like, “Oh yeah, um, there used to be these other tools that created images, but we were working on it in the background, and then we have this image or, or video generator within our tool.”
So now those other tools are kind of obsolete, and those companies, like, go out of business. So anyway AI backlash. Shoot me an email, feedback@doug.show. I’m curious what you think, what your observations are, and like I said, I’m gonna text, uh, my friend Paul because he’s, he’s in it deep, and he’s covering the news stories and like, “Hey, what’s coming out next?”
Um, kinda thing. And that is, again, the opposite of like where I’m sitting right now, so I’m like, “Oh, man, I wonder, I wonder, um, what that conversation will bring.” The other part is he’s like, he’s, he’s grown his YouTube channel a ton, and it’s super interesting ’cause I know he was searching for like, you know, the right pivot for him because some of the things he was working on, it was starting to, you know, shift and not be as, um, fun for him, maybe not as profitable, that kinda thing.
All right, so that’s it for today. Thanks a lot, and we’ll catch you on the next episode.